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  1. #31
    Join Date
    Nov 2012
    Posts
    2

    Red face Re: How to break up a circuit with a shared neutral?

    rickpantel,
    One more clarification I don't know if I saw addressed was your question as to whether losing the neutral to the house is the same thing. It would be except for one fundamental difference. Your house main panel is tied to earth ground (water pipe/ground rod(s)), so although the incoming might be floating a bit if it loses neutral, it's probably balanced enough and tied to ground somewhere back up the line (at the pole transformer) so that the two hot legs are not straying to far. So even if your two sides in your house are not totally balanced, they both return to earth ground and you would not see the same kind of failures you might on the inside of a house losing a neutral with a shared neutral ckt tied to opposite phases. That's also why you don't hear too much about that kind of fault in the news. In fact, I'm sure power companies run into tree limbs breaking just the neutral wire all the time... with no damage to the house contents.

    One other interesting item - from my brother. He once ran into a trailer which was NOT tied to ground. Lost neutral from the pole. When they arrived they found a pile outside of air conditioners, electronics, lights, appliances, etc. all fried from seeing 240v [or nearly]. Bonding the trailer to the neutral was ok, but maybe the owner should have then tied the trailer [or better, the main box itself] to some ground rods... ya think?

  2. #32
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Location
    Fayette County, Ohio
    Posts
    5,555

    Default Re: How to break up a circuit with a shared neutral?

    Being against code may not stop a home owner who needs another circuit from changing the MWBC from two breakers on separate legs to a mini double breaker with both on the same leg. Not all work is done by licensed or knowledgeable people.

    Jack
    Be sure you live your life, because you are a long time dead.-Scottish Proverb

  3. #33
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Location
    Midwest
    Posts
    179

    Default Re: How to break up a circuit with a shared neutral?

    Quote Originally Posted by JLMCDANIEL View Post
    Being against code may not stop a home owner who needs another circuit from changing the MWBC from two breakers on separate legs to a mini double breaker with both on the same leg. Not all work is done by licensed or knowledgeable people.

    Jack

    Very true. I didn't go back and read all the posts, and I sure don't remember it much except for my misspelling of amateur That thread was from 2008,coming back to life after that long it should be called Frankenthread.
    "Lead by Example"

  4. #34
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Location
    Columbiana, Alabama
    Posts
    623

    Default Re: How to break up a circuit with a shared neutral?

    Quote Originally Posted by peacher View Post
    rickpantel,
    One more clarification I don't know if I saw addressed was your question as to whether losing the neutral to the house is the same thing. It would be except for one fundamental difference. Your house main panel is tied to earth ground (water pipe/ground rod(s)), so although the incoming might be floating a bit if it loses neutral, it's probably balanced enough and tied to ground somewhere back up the line (at the pole transformer) so that the two hot legs are not straying to far. So even if your two sides in your house are not totally balanced, they both return to earth ground and you would not see the same kind of failures you might on the inside of a house losing a neutral with a shared neutral ckt tied to opposite phases. That's also why you don't hear too much about that kind of fault in the news. In fact, I'm sure power companies run into tree limbs breaking just the neutral wire all the time... with no damage to the house contents.

    One other interesting item - from my brother. He once ran into a trailer which was NOT tied to ground. Lost neutral from the pole. When they arrived they found a pile outside of air conditioners, electronics, lights, appliances, etc. all fried from seeing 240v [or nearly]. Bonding the trailer to the neutral was ok, but maybe the owner should have then tied the trailer [or better, the main box itself] to some ground rods... ya think?
    Actually, the ground rod(s)play a minor role in clearing (tripping breakers) a fault other than lightning.

    If the neutral (bare) wire is broken apart where it comes into a building, what you described above, fried 120 volt appliances, is quite common.

    As was pointed out (above) the feed to the house is a MWBC.

    The greatest value the OP will see is that he will now have a ground at each outlet and can now install AFCI's because he replaced his MWBC's. Once installed, MWBC's (I've done many) are safe, efficient and in-expensive.
    Good Luck from Columbiana, Alabama
    Maurice Turgeon, Hidden Content

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