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  1. #21
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    Default Re: Plumbing experts-? traps

    Quote Originally Posted by Blue RidgeParkway View Post
    house traps/masons traps/running traps arent legal in many areas with dedicated sanitary only sewer systems. they went the way of the drum traps and cesspools - obsolete. still think its legit question? lots of advances in santiary plumbing since 1920s!

    why? they tend to get sucked dry from other drainage activites downstream in the sewer and tend to hold solids/clog. weather/pressure changes and the trap empties like a barometer. back in the days when entire plumbing was within five feet of the single stack vent.

    fumes in a septic tank and even in a municpial sewer can be under pressure the fumes simply can bubble through the water in the trap and cause the same problem.

    traps and vents are related!

    The purpose of the trap is to form a water seal which prevents sewer gas from entering the building.

    The purpose of the vent is to assure that the water in the trap is not pushed or sucked out by the movement of water through other parts of the drainage system.

    vents also break vacuums so water flows down the pipes faster. remember the catsup bottle analogy? they let fresh air in and foul air out and equalize pressures.

    a running trap or house trap alone didnt do the job. this is why all fixtures non mechanically draining fixtures have to be trapped and vented now. when all fixtures are trapped and vented and the main is also vented the running trap becomes obsolete except for the cleanouts.
    just wondering
    "" an ounce of perception -- a pound of obscure "
    - Rush

  2. #22
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    Nov 2007
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    Default Re: Plumbing experts-? traps

    *** blue ridge aren't you just the ray of sunshine here. just tell me this, how is your long winded tirade supposed to help anyone? to try to raise oneself up by standing on the backs of others is to put oneself in a dangerous position of falling flat on your face.

  3. #23
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    Default Re: Plumbing experts-? traps

    Quote Originally Posted by Blue RidgeParkway View Post
    house traps/masons traps/running traps (between house drain and house sewer) arent legal in many areas with dedicated sanitary only sewer systems. they went the way of the drum traps and cesspools - obsolete. still think its legit question? lots of advances in santiary plumbing since 1920s!
    As I said "other than code requirements", we all know they are obsolete. The question is why? And this doesn't answer that question.

    why? they tend to get sucked dry from other drainage activites downstream in the sewer and tend to hold solids/clog. weather/pressure changes and the trap empties like a barometer. back in the days when entire plumbing was within five feet of the single stack vent.

    fumes in a septic tank and even in a municpial sewer can be under pressure the fumes simply can bubble through the water in the trap and cause the same problem.

    traps and vents are related!
    As I said "The function of the traps and the function of the vents are two different things" , the trap holds water to produce a seal against sewer gas the vent prevents the trap from being sucked dry by drainage activities down stream and to provide a vent for excess gas pressure. My question was about the trap I said nothing about doing away with the necessary venting.
    The purpose of the trap is to form a water seal which prevents sewer gas from entering the building.

    The purpose of the vent is to assure that the water in the trap is not pushed or sucked out by the movement of water through other parts of the drainage system.

    vents also break vacuums so water flows down the pipes faster. remember the catsup bottle analogy? they let fresh air in and foul air out and equalize pressures.
    Just repeating what has already be stated.

    a running trap or house trap alone didnt do the job. this is why all fixtures non mechanically draining fixtures have to be trapped and vented now. when all fixtures are trapped and vented and the main is also vented the running trap becomes obsolete except for the cleanouts.
    In your last paragraph you state "a running trap or house trap alone didnt do the job" on what facts do you make this statement or are you just refereeing a trap with no vent? I made no implication or statement in the original question that there would be no requirement for venting.
    Jack
    Be sure you live your life, because you are a long time dead.-Scottish Proverb

  4. #24
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    Default Re: Plumbing experts-? traps

    Quote Originally Posted by JLMCDANIEL View Post
    In your last paragraph you state "a running trap or house trap alone didnt do the job" on what facts do you make this statement or are you just refereeing a trap with no vent? I made no implication or statement in the original question that there would be no requirement for venting.
    Jack

    the first three paragraphs of my last post which you copied and interjected in addition to what was already pointed out to you regarding it not scouring clean of solids. you copied it but ignored what it said. it is a given that a house trap is vented actually proper was two vents one from inside stack vent usually a wet vent the other was capped outdoors unless the cesspool or septic tank was.

  5. #25
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    Default Re: Plumbing experts-? traps

    Quote Originally Posted by Blue RidgeParkway View Post
    the first three paragraphs of my last post which you copied and interjected in addition to what was already pointed out to you regarding it not scouring clean of solids. you copied it but ignored what it said. it is a given that a house trap is vented actually proper was two vents one from inside stack vent usually a wet vent the other was capped outdoors unless the cesspool or septic tank was.
    And why wouldn't a toilet flush scour clean a main trap?
    Jack
    Be sure you live your life, because you are a long time dead.-Scottish Proverb

  6. #26
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    Jan 2008
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    Default Re: Plumbing experts-? traps

    Quote Originally Posted by JLMCDANIEL View Post
    Code is set not only for safety but to sell products and labor and if possible to make it as difficult for DIYers as possible. And to keep the pros going back for additional training.

    Jack
    wrong plumbing codes are set for public health and sanitation.

    a used bowl flush contains waste it is not "gray" water.

  7. #27
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    Default Re: Plumbing experts-? traps

    Quote Originally Posted by Blue RidgeParkway View Post
    wrong plumbing codes are set for public health and sanitation.

    a used bowl flush contains waste it is not "gray" water.
    Isn't "public health and sanitation" covered by the word safety? Do you honestly believe that that is the only consideration?

    You are correct, it's not "gray" water but a toilet's trap is not cleaned or scrubbed by "gray" water either.

    Jack
    Be sure you live your life, because you are a long time dead.-Scottish Proverb

  8. #28
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    Nov 2007
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    Pennsylvania
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    Default Re: Plumbing experts-? traps

    Quote Originally Posted by Blue RidgeParkway View Post
    wrong plumbing codes are set for public health and sanitation.
    .
    It certainly seem like you know everything from top to bottom, Please for godsake...tell me why there are codes different from the State of Pa, NJ and North Carolina?

    For your information, I used to live in Pa and NJ. I just move to NC 2 years ago also please don't bother copying and pasting information from website search.
    "Life does not go by the book, we learn as we go along".

    You only need two tools in life - WD-40 and Duct Tape.
    If it doesn't move and should, use WD-40.
    If it shouldn't move and does, use the Duct Tape.


  9. #29
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    Default Re: Plumbing experts-? traps

    Blue RidgeParkway you also said "this is why all fixtures non mechanically draining fixtures have to be trapped and vented now. " If you really know code, you would know this is incorrect, there are exceptions.

    Jack
    Be sure you live your life, because you are a long time dead.-Scottish Proverb

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