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  1. #31
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    Default Re: Wireless Internet

    "Unregistered" An expert on everything from wall paper to law...................... LOL! ........ Wonder who that could be.

    Hey though. I have a whole scad of people they can start arresting........ Anyone in downtown anywhere USA who owns a laptop.......... Oh, Hey ****ie, I'm think'n about having an orange jumpsuit tailored this weekend....... You in?

    Okay, another question; what is the difference between secured/unsecured router points and a Wi-Fi connection that I can also see?

  2. #32
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    Default Re: Wireless Internet

    Quote Originally Posted by kentvw View Post
    "Unregistered" An expert on everything from wall paper to law...................... LOL! ........ Wonder who that could be.

    Hey though. I have a whole scad of people they can start arresting........ Anyone in downtown anywhere USA who owns a laptop.......... Oh, Hey ****ie, I'm think'n about having an orange jumpsuit tailored this weekend....... You in?

    Okay, another question; what is the difference between secured/unsecured router points and a Wi-Fi connection that I can also see?
    All you need to know including links and articles on how to secure, MAC addys etc. And specifics on 3rd degree felony in Fla, similar laws passed in other states, and expansion on Fed statutes in various districts. Several states have had reviewed decisions on simple conversion being enough regarding charges with no specific wireless laws on the books.

    Most of the more benign activity is actually found by ICAC and Anti-terrorist investigations, then passed on to local branches of state government to investigate/prosecute, or local justice field offices.

    Not surprised a **** vouyer such as kent resorts to excuses, justifications, and personal attacks. BTW the user agreements on this site prohibit certain uses of it as well, interesting posts against that vain are interesting indeed.

    http://www.securityfocus.com/columnists/237

    This case from the newspaper was over 2-1/2 years ago:
    http://www.sptimes.com/2005/07/04/St...a_new_br.shtml
    The story also outlines several cases that were successfully prosecuted in the years prior in other states.
    and talks about how easily WEP can be cracked, and how if using even if permission it is still a third degree felony to against the internet provider.
    In florida it is a 3rd degree Felony: http://money.cnn.com/2005/07/07/tech...reless_arrest/


    Here's a washington post article from 2007:
    http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn...021001457.html

    Note the extensive tracing network I referred to previously with the Internet Crimes Against Children task forces.

    February 7, 2008 update from philly story case:

    http://www.philly.com/philly/hp/news.../15391047.html

    Piggybacking is still a no-no.
    Unlocked door is a horrible analogy but it is a closed not open door that is unlocked with a default password and unencrypted not an open door with a "come in we're open" sign. If a woman is asleep in her home with the windows open but screens on the windows on a summer's night, she is NOT INVITING a rapist in to victimize her. This is like blaming the victim of a **** for asking for it because she's attractive or dressed provocatively.

    Criminal offense to access another person's wireless network without authorization. In Florida it is a third degree felony. Its also federal to use the ISP without authorization from the ISP with interstate connectivity. Use the connection to VoIP a phone number attached to another state that passes through a telephone switch in another state at some point and you've introduced another federal felony.

    Passwords default or not on a router are a (horrible analogy)door, unlocked though it may be, still a door. Administrator default passwords on a computer, default or not, still a door. Cross that threshold of that door, locked or unlocked but uninvited by express authorization and you've committed the crime, by accessing that host router and computer of your neighbor.

  3. #33
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    Default Re: Wireless Internet

    Did someone say "justify"? ROAR!! That thar is funny.

    Let me clarify or reiterate what I think I've already said somewhere along the way on this thread.

    Our WLAN ISP guy does not care if I leave the router open and the casual passing street-user grabs a connection............or if more people move in here with us for a year and use our subscription the whole dang time. He cares not if I choose to leave my router open and the neighbors use it a bit. How do I know this? He told me when I asked on day-one. This constitutes the dearly beloved "expressed authority". Let me repeat..............he does not care if we share. We have his permission to do so.

    Now if *YOUR* ISP contract clearly states that no sharing whatsoever is allowed or defines who you can and cannot share with (generally okay within the household for ISPs)........and you share outside those terms ..........then yes..........conversion has technically taken place. If/when this unallowed/illegal sharing takes place via an unsecured router that YOU host...........IMO, you and you only should be held responsible.......and not the casual passer-by who only sees a useable/open connection....and knows not if that is intended/legal or unintended/ "illegal".

    ---------------------------

    CONVERSION - The UNLAWFUL turning or applying the personal goods of another to the use of the taker, or of some other person than the owner; or theUNLAWFULdestroying or ALTERING of their nature.

    When a party takes away or WRONGFULLY ASSUMES THE RIGHT to goods which belong to another, it will in general be sufficient evidence of a conversion but when the original taking was lawful, as when the party found the goods, and the detention only is illegal, it is absolutely necessary to make a demand of the goods, and there must be a refusal to deliver them before the conversion will be complete. The refusal by a servant to deliver the goods entrusted to him by his master is not evidence of a conversion by his master.
    -------------------

    See that phrase up there? ........ WRONGFULLY ASSUMES THE RIGHT to goods which belong to another. This is one of the phrases that can be & is...... currently used to "criminalize" & prosecute those LT and I-pod owners........who innocently & unwittingly connect to a wireless router that the owner does not really intend to share, but does anyway......because he/she fails or refuses to assume responsibility for its behavior.

    Rather than take the ridiculously apparent, simple to understand and obvious common-sense approach to resolving such WRONGFULLY ASSUMES THE RIGHT issues by just requiring wireless router owners to secure their device *if* they wish not to share their internet connection.............the courts and legislatures of this country will continue to drag their feet, stick their heads in the sand ( I coulda said somewhere else, ya know) and regurgitate ad nauseum........ existing outdated and disfunctional laws/regulations. Why? Cause that's how they do things. Let us not come to our senses and get a clue........Oh Lord, we pray. Let us make lots of money for lawyers and hand down unwarranted convictions. Amen.

    Now........if I leave a ladder erected, someone trespasses on my property to get to said ladder, commences climbing said ladder (perhaps to intentionally gain illegal entry to the house interior for the purposes of burglary) ........then falls and gets injured..........I can/will be held liable. Why? Well......because the courts say that I enticed them by leaving the ladder up.

    Say what?

    But...... if I don't secure my personal wireless router, a passer-by detects an available network connection from that router on his auto-search & connect system.... direct from Microsoft ..........and the device connects to it against my desires/intentions........I am not liable. Why? No enticement took place according to the courts.....even though I left the router unsecured and beckoning. Rather, he is a criminal and should be prosecuted to the full extent of the law.

    Huh?
    ----------------------------
    Edit:

    ENTICEMENT -

    1. The act or practice of alluring or tempting.

    2. That which entices, or incites to evil; means of allurement; alluring object.

    Syn. -- Allurement; attraction; temptation; seduction; inveiglement; persuasion; inducement.
    Last edited by goldhiller; 03-07-2008 at 10:14 AM.

  4. #34
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    Default Re: Wireless Internet

    ROFL! This has turned into one funny read.

  5. #35
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    Default Re: Wireless Internet

    LOL........ Well, I'm wearing an Orange Harley Davidson motor Clothes shirt today so I'm half way there...

    So yeah, I was able to pull up a screen that showed all available connections and the secured ones were named. The unsecured ones I could see were named Linksys like you mentioned and they were listed by signal strength. However, our clubhouse is right across the street from me and one signal was named our community name and came up as Wi-Fi I'm sure it's the 'puter across the street which is available for community use. It's the only signal I could see that was listed as such and I was not able to to connect to it. But, unlike the secured routers which ask for a pass word the Wi-Fi just came back with an "unable to connect" message. Maybe due to poor signal strength, don't know.

    So, with that, what's the diff between a router and wi-fi?

    Okay, back to surfing

  6. #36
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    Default Re: Wireless Internet

    Makes you wonder, does it not? How "Unregistered" could know such secrets........................

  7. #37
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    Default Re: Wireless Internet

    It certainly seems to deteriorate rather rapidly when you try to have a logical discussion on a differing point of view, doesn't it?
    Jack
    Be sure you live your life, because you are a long time dead.-Scottish Proverb

  8. #38
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    Default Re: Wireless Internet

    Kent/aka....the voyuer,

    A router can be either hard-wired/cable only.........or it can be a combo hard-wire and wireless device (with Wi-Fi ability).

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wi-Fi

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wireless_router

    As far as connecting to that community clubhouse SSID across the street..........

    Well, the issue might be one of range, like you said.

    The failure to connect could be because the signal from your LT cannot reach it. (Your LT can hear its voice, but can't holler back loud enough to be heard on the other end) The range of a wireless router is normally greater than the range of the wireless card/device within the LT. It has an internal antenna. The range of the LT's device can be increased by adding on an external antenna. Many types/prices available. One of the simplest and most common is a "rubber duckie". There are also many other types available for purchase that can reach even farther (cost a bit more)..... and then there are those that you can build yourself. Some really easy, others more complex to construct.

    Or......the failure to connect may that the router/wi-fi device is secured and you're not on the "guest list". Or...the puter itself may be available for community use....but no resident is allowed wireless internet access thru the SSID you see. Might be, might not. Perhaps all you have to do is give them your LT's MAC addy and then they'll add that to the permitted internet access list. Don't know. Asking them would be the quickest easiest route to an answer........and perhaps a free "legal" internet connection. Doesn't cost much to ask what the deal is.

    Lots of SSIDs showing on your screen, eh? I'd bet there's even more within range that aren't showing up because they're cloaked from normal detection software. The world is absolutely stuffed with wireless devices these days.

  9. #39
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    Default Re: Wireless Internet

    I think it's all wytch craft and magic.
    Jack
    Be sure you live your life, because you are a long time dead.-Scottish Proverb

  10. #40
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    Aug 2007
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    The Great White North
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    4,045

    Default Re: Wireless Internet

    JLM .... you little Devil.

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