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  1. #41
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Location
    Tennessee
    Posts
    1,419

    Default Re: Covered Porch Beams not Resting on *anything*!

    The rebar was just a suggestion on my part. I hope someone else will weight in on this one. It may not be required, but I can't help but think that if rebar was used in the first place, you might not be having to pour new pads now.

    If you have a regular drill, you might try it with just the masonry drill bit, I have done that but it is much slower than a hammer drill. I was only drilling 1/4" holes about 3" deep so a hammer drill was not necessary. Its just a question of the amount of time you have. I also did not have a carbide tipped drill bit, just a cheapy. I'd spend more money on the drill bit and get the cheaper hammer drill if necessary.

  2. #42
    Join Date
    Sep 2012
    Location
    Eastern Kansas
    Posts
    104

    Default Re: Covered Porch Beams not Resting on *anything*!

    Thanks for the quick reply.

    I was just talking to a coworker who has done some work of this nature and the thought maybe the rebar would not be necessary. I'm still mulling it over. By placing the column atop the floor framing that seems to be the key for load distribution. And while the rebar seems like it would help with any off-center load, maybe it's not significant, and certainly having the rebar in there will make any future corrections/adjustments more difficult (but then again -- it may prevent all future problems!). He also suggested I look at digging down alongside the footers and possibly pry-barring them over as needed. In essence, center the footers. In the least I may dig down alongside one just to see how deep they go. I do have 2 that clearly settled. Where I may have a real issue is if the footers are too high such that I do not have room for 4" pad, 13" block, and 7.5" framing. I have to go measure.

    I guess in those cases, I could stack 4" cap blocks instead of using the 8" hollow block.

  3. #43
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Location
    Tennessee
    Posts
    1,419

    Default Re: Covered Porch Beams not Resting on *anything*!

    remember, you can notch those 2x8's like I did. They do not lose any strength that way.

  4. #44
    Join Date
    Sep 2012
    Location
    Eastern Kansas
    Posts
    104

    Default Re: Covered Porch Beams not Resting on *anything*!

    Right -- maybe an inch or so, I'd hate to take out several inches of the 7.5"

    Maybe after some Turkey tomorrow.. I'll do some measuring. Any suggestions for how to lay out the height of the footers/pads? I'm just thinking to find level with the floor at the house and then come down 1.5" (that's over a 6' distance). That would be my floor height at the rim joist. Then I come down the thickness of the floor, the 7.5" RJ, the 4" cap, and so on.

  5. #45
    Join Date
    Sep 2012
    Location
    Eastern Kansas
    Posts
    104

    Default Re: Covered Porch Beams not Resting on *anything*!

    Fall came and went, and I never got this fixed. I have about 1/3 of the t&g flooring torn off. I need to now sort out the footer/pier issue and get going. Anyone else have thoughts?

  6. #46
    Join Date
    Sep 2012
    Location
    Eastern Kansas
    Posts
    104

    Default Re: Covered Porch Beams not Resting on *anything*!

    This -- http://www.thisoldhouse.com/toh/how-...262821,00.html -- seems to have a lot of good info and is to my situation, even though in my case I'm dealing with a wrap around porch floor.

    I dug down besides my pillars today. As I have mentioned before, there does seem to be a 6" concrete pillar that extends down below frost line. I dug down about 14-18" and it was still going. My frost line is around 24". The problem with my porch columns sitting directly atop these pillars, is that the 6x6 column apparently did not align directly atop the pillars, so the builder got creative and poured a "pad" of about 12" diameter atop the pillars. Unfortunately the pad must have been fairly "thin" where it touched the pillar, and so over time the pad has cracked and dropped below the pillar. What's visible in many cases is the pillar stickup up through the pad (but in reality the pad settled down below the pillar. The reason for the pad appears to be because the columns (6x6 cedar) did not end up directly over the 6" dia. pillar. But clearly this pad idea was bad for at least 2 reasons -- 1) it's thickness where it met the pillar was too thin -- a few inches -- at best 5" and 2) since the column was not centered over the pier to being with, sitting the column atop the pad, just resulted in a pad that tipped.

    Now then -- I'm trying to assess my solution. Do I dig around my 6" piers and pour more concrete around them resulting in something like a 12" pillar? Is that ok? I don't think the new pour would adhere to the original 6" pier - correct? So is that going to be a problem? Do I have to remover the old 6" pier and then pour a new 12" one? Another alternative might be to dig entirely new 8" or 12" piers -- sit my porch framing atop those, and rest my porch support columns atop my porch floor/framing. Which of these is my best option?

    Any help greatly appreciated.

    Here are some photos that may help with visualizing -- http://tinypic.com/useralbum.php?ua=...Tawl687A%3D%3D

  7. #47
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Location
    SoCal
    Posts
    5,441

    Default Re: Covered Porch Beams not Resting on *anything*!

    From your photos, which I finally got to see, you need new piers.

    As I mentioned some 7 months ago, pour new piers with attached Simpson connectors, so that your posts will tied down in a safe manner.

    Better yet, hire a carpenter to do it for you, because I'm afraid you'll never get it done.

  8. #48
    Join Date
    Sep 2012
    Location
    Eastern Kansas
    Posts
    104

    Default Re: Covered Porch Beams not Resting on *anything*!

    My plan now is to rest the framing on the pier (or blocks atop the pier), and then rest the columns atop the framing/flooring. Another here posted photos of this approach - one of my sketches shows that also. Is that reasonable? That is how the original plans show. The builder apparently took his own route.

    As I noted, the piers are 6" dia. and probably below frost line. I dug down 14-18" and it was still going. Frost line here is 24", with deck codes that I could find specifying 36". The problems are:
    1) those 6" piers are not centered where they need to be to directly support the 6"x6" column.
    2) I suspect the piers should be 12" for the load they carry

    Do I need to remove the 6" x 36" deep exiting pier? Or can I put a 12" tube around the existing 6" pier and pour more concrete? I may have to place that 12" tube a bit off center of the existing 6" pier to get the new pier where I want it.

    Know a quality carpenter in the area? I'd take your recommendation, but the "builder" is the one who did this to begin with ;-)

  9. #49
    Join Date
    Apr 2013
    Location
    southern CT
    Posts
    15

    Default Re: Covered Porch Beams not Resting on *anything*!

    i wouls just shim it with pt and keep a eye on it over the next couple years. sounds like settling

  10. #50
    Join Date
    Sep 2012
    Location
    Eastern Kansas
    Posts
    104

    Default Re: Covered Porch Beams not Resting on *anything*!

    Quote Originally Posted by Newton Carpenters LLC View Post
    i wouls just shim it with pt and keep a eye on it over the next couple years. sounds like settling
    Yeah, the tricky part is the columns are resting directly on the piers, in some cases below grade, and the builder poured an off-center pad atop the piers such that the column is not centered over the pier, but off to one side. The pads are tipping, cracking, etc. And -- the flooring is rotted about 30% -- and -- the framing was all untreated also rotting -- and the ledger was just wood screwed to the siding.

    Yeah..

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